Halo_Mauler finally does his job and makes a good ban! Congrats to the Moderator of the Day!

[RichardCoffee]

DRM and fog click detector are 2 very different things

Not really. Isn't FCD using the same exact data? Otherwise, how would it be able to tell you who fogclicked or not.

[halo_mauler]

DRM tells you every keystroke and click in the game it’s up the mod to verify if they had vision at the time it helped having two monitors some people simply clicked Roshan in the past

[RichardCoffee]

DRM tells you every keystroke and click in the game it’s up the mod to verify if they had vision at the time it helped having two monitors some people simply clicked Roshan in the past

Right. FCD is using the same thing, just alerting users when it thinks it saw a fog click. Unless you're playing dota in sunglasses like The Terminator, you probably won't make much progress sifting through raw data unless another program tells you someone fog clicked in one of their 90 clicks a minute.

Anyway, this all is irrelevant. Because like I said, I suspect most MHs have disabled "fog clicking" a very long time ago. I suspect this was about 10 years ago that all the MHs updated their software. I never used MH, so I don't know the details, but I'd strongly suspect this is the case, given that fogclicks became non-existent and never reported.

[halo_mauler]

Yes you have to sift through data files this is why 2 monitors help but you can sort by actions and color to help clear things we also had a tool called replay seeker so you could rewind replays. DRM works on hellhalt hellraiser used it to look for bugs

[RichardCoffee]

Yes you have to sift through data files this is why 2 monitors help but you can sort by actions and color to help clear things we also had a tool called replay seeker so you could rewind replays

Sure, but I'm saying that MH programs don't allow fog clicks anymore...because the people who programmed them realized admins were using the software you reference to catch cheaters...so if you began using it again, you'd be looking for something that doesn't exist anymore.

[halo_mauler]

You cant hide a click or keystroke from drm as you can see it worked in 2018 i doubt they came up with something new after bnet removed plugins in 2019

[RichardCoffee]

AI_Mauler,

The people who reverse-engineered the game's code to reveal the whole map also added a small line of code to disallow the MH user to click units in fog, but still allow them to click visible units. This means a fogclick will never show up using that system. The latest example you can give is from 6 years ago. And that is still unverified, since he said it MIGHT have been a fog click.

[halo_mauler]

Guess you just dont understand, it doesn't matter if you have vision of the whole map if you select a hero or anything the click or keystroke is in the replay. And it is up to the admin to find it you cant hide your keystrokes and clicks. The guy in the ban request wouldn't have been banned if he didn't go back and verify.
As you can see from the post in 2018 MH still wasn't able to hide from drm I'm sure no 1 is reverse engineering the game when it was 15 years old anyway

[halo_mauler]

Also who are the people who did the reverse engineering? Why are they telling you? When did they do this? Why have so many people been banned for fog clicks if they were hidden? Ent has been wrong all this time?

[halo_mauler]

Maybe they did change something 10 years ago to hide from fdc but as you can see they weren't able to hide it from drm as of 6 yrs ago I doubt anything had changed since then

[EdteOfChaos2]

@halo_mauler Go find the last processed maphacking ban for a fog click. What year was it from?

[halo_mauler]

Aug 2018 by Falanga is the one I posted 2019 is when ent shut down

[EdteOfChaos2]

Ok, so your latest example of a fog click ban is 6 and a half years ago and before the last pre-reforged wc3 patch. I exaggerated slightly with 10 years, but thank you for accidentally proving my point. Why are you even a moderator if you're so clueless about the current state of things? I understand you don't play DotA, but this fog click stuff is basic knowledge, something I knew with barely being active in the past years.

[halo_mauler]

Drm still works with hellhalt patch or no patch
One of you said that mh was updated 10 years ago to mask for clicks that's simply not true.
And ent runs on a patch that's 2018 or 2019 no new platform patches

[EdteOfChaos2]

Ok - didn't really want to go into the details because I didn't want to advertise how advanced maphack has become, but there is a reason why there are no known fog clicks after 2018

In late 2018, the maphack developer patched out the ability to click units in the fog. it reveals them on the map but they are unclickable. it's a feature of the maphack that people have talked about on the official forum for the maphack. I don't want to spread the link around public but I can send it to you if you would like. It's a feature you can toggle but by default you can't fog click because obviously the maker of the maphack is aware that people were doing this to catch MHers.

I don't know why you're so fixated on it being 6 years old instead of 10 years. Yes I did exaggerate a bit but the point (which you are maybe deliberately missing) is still the same. Your response of "umm acktually, it's only been SIX years since the last fogclick ever happened, not TEN, so my knowledge of fog clicks is totally relevant and important" is hilarious.

Attached is a screenshot that someone posted on the MH forum for it. As you can see, they can see everything through fog but can't select it. It also doesn't mark the terrain as revealed so you can't use that to figure it out either.

1212122.thumb.png.7e95e135575a27d85b236b1122b4a554.png (516.18 KiB) Viewed 95 times

If you are trying to use fog clicks to catch maphackers, you will never catch a single person unless they voluntarily opt in to being caught. Here is an official description of the features:

Map hack
Camera range hack
reveals enemy's cooldown on spells/items
reveals Enemy pings
and a bonus:
load hack - useful to smoke a joint for 1-2 min while the screen is loading

there are some more options, like removing fog or being able to click on enemies to check their items/spells even in fogged spaces.(only this isdettectable)

Lag hack doesnt exist. Its the players with high ping or bad internet connection for the computer, where bot is hosting, which cause dropping of players

(so clearly if someone does not want to be detected, they would not turn the option on)

And no DRM does not record keystrokes, it records inputs to the game. Only a limited amount of keystrokes (and clicks, since keystroke usually refers to keyboard click) actually becomes inputs that go anywhere. So usually: Player mouse click -> sends "click" to game server -> game selects unit. However, maphack gets in the way of that and prevents the click from ever going through to the server so you never see it in DRM. Fog clicks were also ALWAYS notoriously unreliable. Only fog clicks you could really count on were those that were obviously deep in enemy fog because WC3's fog draw is really strange, a unit can count as in fog for one person and not for the other. This frequently happened for side shops where the vision is bad due to the trees so it's really simple for a mher to know when not to click. All of this is irrelevant now because fog clicks are impossible. I actually used to investigate MH and verify fog clicks and I've been keeping up with things since then, man it's so frustrating to see a completely clueless person speaking like they know what they're talking abou. Too dumb to even understand how dumb he is. Even back then when fog clicks were common, a blind hook or blind dust was bannable for MH unless explained.

If this description doesn't make sense to you, please have someone who isn't a moron read it and try to explain it to you in a way that you can understand, because after trying to be so patient with you for so long I'm not in the mood to be nice about it anymore.

mh1.png (606.43 KiB) Viewed 67 times

^ This poor clown didn't even realize that it's a feature to help him not get banned, not a bug.

mh2.png (88.49 KiB) Viewed 71 times

^ Take a moment to laugh at all the people spending $5 a month to maphack on a dead game, just to boost their ELO and still not get any respect because everyone knows they cheated to do it.

edit to add even more evidence