[DOTA] gr1mly grieving/refusal to defend.

[javierbrown2008]

Replay Link: http://storage.entgaming.net/replay/vie ... 972130.w3g
Game Name: [ENT] DotA apem us/ca #78
Your Warcraft III Username: jaggedcrown
Violator's Warcraft III Username: gr1mly
Violated Rule(s): grieving/refusal to defend
Time of Violation (in-game or replay): Minute 32
Any further thoughts:

other team is pushing mid rax, and oj and blue are top refusing to defend.

Oj was actually doing something useful though by pushing lane.

Blue(gr1mly) just ran through their woods doing nothing.

when called on the refusal to defend, he says he just read the rules, and that not helping defend isnt bannable.

Spoiler!

(32:56 / Allied) g1mly: I just read the rules noob

Do not go away from keyboard for an excessive amount of time, especially without telling other players beforehand, and/or refuse to play the game in an attempt to ruin it. Neither are you allowed to grief by resetting the afk timer.

and here we have the rule on not playing... not helping defend, espeically as necro with an AOE heal woudl have been better than nothing, which is what we got.

that and being 0/9/0... no kills, and no assists even...

all over Oj going mid, who was actually our best player...

@hyo
@I3omb

[BeerLord]

I watched this, and I think this "refusal to defend" and the linking of this with "grieving" are a bit overstated. gr1mly was pushing top trying to get a rax while the other team was raxing mid. In my opinion this may have been a poor decision, but there was no hint of "refusal to defend" in this action, just a bad outcome in trying to trade one rax for another. The rule "not helping to defend" I think implies you are doing something unimportant to the team effort, such as creeping in another lane or in the forest. Trying, albeit ineffectually, to rax the other team does not fit that scenario in my opinion. I think this should be denied.

[javierbrown2008]

the fact that ursa pushed the lane and gr1mly didnt is why this was posted..

on top of that... a t2 tower isnt a fair trade for a rax tower and rax themselves.

so it was posted bc of that fact.. oj was doing something like getting a tower.. blue, who the request is for, did absolutely nothing and ran through the forest.

[BeerLord]

At min 31 and a half scourge is trying to rax mid. At that time oj is taking a t-2 tower and blue (g1mly) is walking through the forest to oj. Oj kills the tower, and i agree its a poor trade for mid rax, and tps to base. Blue, who is lacking a tp scroll or boots of travel, arrives to oj at 32:09, just as oj is tp'ing home. He then continues the push and attempts to rax top on his own. I get that it may not have been the best decision to proceed to oj's position without a tp scroll but this does not constitute greiving to me, nor a refusal to defend. To me its just bad judgement ( I have the same malady myself at times).

[javierbrown2008]

then thats still bannable... why would you push that late and not have a scroll.. and they knew they were getting ready to push.. add to that his 0/9/0... he was only useful to the other team.. he provided nothing.. and he has an aoe aura that hurts... if he is just around them when they die to us, he'd have an assist... pure and simple he did nothing for us, and game ruined. no defending, no assisting, and overall just qqing over oj going mid.

[javierbrown2008]

@king23

i never even saw this till just now lol

https://entgaming.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=75796

but its kinda funny how idiotic that request is.

i stated the rules, which he did in fact break.. he did not kill even 1 creep top, as he was in jungle.

and this little speel at the end about not knowing rules and that that is bannable. lol.. well.. glad i got a good laugh.

[KinG23]

People are quite entertaining sometimes!

[g1mly]

I just logged in to follow up on my request to ban user jaggedcrown based on https://entgaming.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=75796.

I think this is just pathetic, I'm only trying to defend myself from an abusive mad user. I had a damn bad game, yes, but defending is always my prority, but dota is not always about defending only. All I did is follow ursa to rax top, he had a TP and having 4 at base was better than 3, so I gave it a try to rax top, to at least made it even. He also accused me of "feeding" I mean really? WHY?! Getting Owned is not feed. Period.

Also something that I think is really important. I am not an native English speaker, the word "grieving" Is new to me. I searched that at the WIKI, in the General rules and DOTA rules. There is NOTHING about that word nor about "not defending" (which I did not do !!! )

With this being said, if that "rule" is not there, then he lied to me. Regardless if I did or not "grieving", he lied and that is bannable, according to general rules , " Do not deceive players about rules in an attempt to get them banned (note, !draw is not an obligation, but a vote). "

[KinG23]

From the rules:

Do not go away from keyboard for an excessive amount of time, especially without telling other players beforehand, and/or refuse to play the game in an attempt to ruin it. Neither are you allowed to grief by resetting the afk timer.

[g1mly]

Correct, but, it has to be read as a complete sentence, you are ignoring the rest of it " BY RESETTING THE AFK TIMER ".
This game has nothing to do with AFK.

And again, his statement is incorrect, so, he is lying to me by assuring that NOT DEFENDING is ban, when there is no rule that states that. (and I still continue defending myself, I never refused to defend, I ATTACKED instead trying to do something good for the team)

[Jabba41]

@g1mly Noone has to quote the rules 1:1 as long as the sense stays the same.

Do not go away from keyboard for an excessive amount of time, especially without telling other players beforehand, and/or refuse to play the game in an attempt to ruin it. Neither are you allowed to grief by resetting the afk timer.

->If you refuse to defend and just mess around you're refusing to play the game.

Locked until review.
Thanks for input.

[Mercy]

g1mly banned 5d for refusal to defend, appealable should he understand that he must defend / play until scoreboard shows.