LTD Leaving

[Karils]

From my understanding, currently the system applies the win/loss to your account the same as it would have had you not left a game. Is there any possibility or has there been a thought prior about adding an ELO loss to leaving? I personally feel like it would be beneficial to at least LTD, and probably others as well.

I say this because in my opinion, it bothers me that when someone purposefully leaves people attempt to get a draw because it is unfair for the team which had a player leave. This means that the person that left also does not lose ELO if you draw, because they still count as part of that team. Having been in situations where someone leaves when it appears your team would win the game regardless of that, it seems dumb to me that one person leaving can cause themselves to not lose ELO if people draw, despite the fact that they may have been in a losing position. I may not be conveying my thought process properly, so please ask for clarification if it doesn't make sense, or feel free to counter and say why it shouldn't be a thing.

I think with GProxy and such, people shouldn't be disconnecting anyway, so it wouldn't be that big of an issue for accidentally leaving if the players are using these tools as they should.


Edit: In choosing how much ELO it should make the player lose, I think it'd probably just be easiest if there were a way to apply it as a loss, so they lose less if facing a stacked team and vice versa.

[Karils]

@karils Basically, to summarize, you are asking for the following:

If someone leaves a game, even if the game is drawn, they incur a loss and potentially a loss of elo as well. The purpose is to further discourage trying to force a draw through leaving.

Does the above pretty much summarize what you are looking for?

[Karils]

@karils Basically, to summarize, you are asking for the following:

If someone leaves a game, even if the game is drawn, they incur a loss and potentially a loss of elo as well. The purpose is to further discourage trying to force a draw through leaving.

Does the above pretty much summarize what you are looking for?

Yes, that is it exactly. I don't think it's fair that people are forced into losing a game because a teammate, which they likely don't even know, left. With that said, I feel conflicted choosing to draw in such a scenario, because I know I'm also making sure the person that left doesn't lose ELO either.

As a side note, I'd be comfortable saying that most people do not realize that leaving the game still counts them as on that team for that ELO change.

EDIT: To add onto this, I'm asking for this because I feel this path is the more reasonable of the two if considering to make force drawing a rule on disconnects/leaves versus making leaving an instant loss.

[AmnoN]

@karils There is precedent for this - in WC3 ladder, if you leave early enough and your team still wins, you do not get the win or any ELO. I would not be opposed to a leaver not getting the win or any ELO.

I would not recommend forcing a draw for leavers since you would end up with so many draws if people leave just because they get a bad roll, etc. - enforcing an ELO penalty for leaving is one way to mitigate this.

[Karils]

I support the idea of enforcing additional penalties to users that decide to leave before the game is certainly done. There are a number of games that would benefit from penalties placed against players that leave/DC (i know DC is sometimes random, however, it may make it a bit of an incentive to actually install a reconnection tool if possible). It's not only LTD, but DotA/LoD/Hellhalt (all the main ones that track stats) that have some players that will leave for various reasons.

Having additional penalties other than just a ban duration, may help deter the individuals from repeat offending as their ELO and w/l record could be affected by such things.

This sort of system is already used with the in-house leagues (via reports from users) where the user(s) will have a DC penalty against their ELO. This was only meant as an example, but i'm sure it would help with the public bots, if the system could be automated.

Anyways, just my opinion on the topic at hand. Hopefully I was fairly clear with what I've noted above.

[Karils]

@karils There is precedent for this - in WC3 ladder, if you leave early enough and your team still wins, you do not get the win or any ELO. I would not be opposed to a leaver not getting the win or any ELO.

I would not recommend forcing a draw for leavers since you would end up with so many draws if people leave just because they get a bad roll, etc. - enforcing an ELO penalty for leaving is one way to mitigate this.

I'd like to clarify that I'm NOT in favor of making draw mandatory, just that I feel like some sort of protocol needs to be placed that both helps punish leavers and potentially helps benefit people on the team they left from. Those were simply the only two that came to mind.

[aRt)Y]

While public bots have ELO to roughly measure your skill, it is not meant to 100% reflect your level. In my opinion, ENT's leagues are exactly for this.

Furthermore, and let's be real here, these are "just" public games. They are punished by a system for leaving and that's it. Taking ELO into the punishment-equation makes thing unnecessary complicated.

Therefore, stick to leagues where ELO actually means something.