ENT Gaming

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Featuring:

5 int versus husk, magus, and omni
90-minute duration
10 minutes of successfully defending a base with no towers and 4 rax down
6-slotted spec
Pugna (justifiably!) going late-game rapier deso
Multiple premature "gg"s

and much, much more.

I see a lot of questionable decisions here. I didn't watch the replay but sentinel should obviously win by picks.

- Spectre does not have BKB or Manta-style against a team full of silence. Yes he can diffusal himself, but it's limited and then he can't slow enemies which is presumably why he bought it. If he changed Heart -> Skaddi and Diffusal -> BKB, maybe he would have carried correctly. Spectre should rip int heroes to pieces. Recently I've started getting Skaddi instead of Heart on almost every hero I used to build Heart on, and it just works so much better imo. It's such a strong item.

- I see 3 Linken spheres on Sentinel. Pugna's ult has zero second CD, and Spectre dagger goes through Linken and cancels it too, making it a poor decision for this game.

- Omniknight bought Shiva's Guard. Ordinarily this would be a good choice, but the scourge is almost entirely magic damage; your armor is going to be next-to-useless, and the slow aura doesn't even affect the Death Ward (which is the only physical damage, until super pugna hit)

- Rubick bought Shiva's Guard. Now the team only needs one of those anyways since the slow shit doesn't even stack which is 50% of the power of Shiva. Why a rubick would have one of those to begin with is beyond me, he's not the tank.

- Huskar bought hood of defiance. Is berserker's blood + Rubick aura not enough for you? What would you EVER need 150% magic resistance for? A carry wasted a slot on a 2k gold item and didn't even upgrade it to pipe

- Non-upgraded hood on Mirana. Why does no one upgrade this to pipe, has the recipe been forgotten? He ended the game with enough gold for it.

- On the scourge side: three people made E-Blade but no one made Veil of Discord? It stacks and is just about as strong.

- Four people didn't manage to complete their items in 90 minutes.

Anyone got more? Lol
Also WD ended game with over 10k. L0L.

Mirana finished with 3-19. VIVA BRAZIL

Edgeofchaos wrote:Omniknight bought Shiva's Guard. Ordinarily this would be a good choice, but the scourge is almost entirely magic damage; your armor is going to be next-to-useless, and the slow aura doesn't even affect the Death Ward (which is the only physical damage, until super pugna hit)

Ironically, when Omni was bitching about there being so much silence halfway through the game, I suggested that he get a BKB. He blew me off and claimed that they'd win anyway.

- On the scourge side: three people made E-Blade but no one made Veil of Discord? It stacks and is just about as strong.

Pugna had veil earlier in the game but ditched it when he rebuilt for physical damage.

lol wtf, how the F did this happen

Edgeofchaos wrote:Recently I've started getting Skaddi instead of Heart on almost every hero I used to build Heart on, and it just works so much better imo. It's such a strong item.

I've been saying that for ages! People just laugh at me when I say it.

I hate heart, all it does is give bulk. Skadi gives you so much more with the stats - bulk, IAS, armor, mana, frost. Even satanic will give you lifesteal.

Heart is only useful if you can't depend on your teammates and or/need to tank consistently while also having the ability to jump in/out of fights.

Skadi is clearly the better item in a fight but by that logic, Heart would be one of the worst items value-wise in that same scenario.

Overall, both items have their necessary uses. I just find that in pub games, you can rarely expect your teammates to help so the better item to get would be Heart as it would allow you to pick off the enemy team without wasting valuable time. Otherwise, in organized games, there should be enough support via urn, teammates spells, and overall teamwork that would generally make Heart less desirable.

Edgeofchaos wrote:I see a lot of questionable decisions here. I didn't watch the replay but sentinel should obviously win by picks.

- Spectre does not have BKB or Manta-style against a team full of silence. Yes he can diffusal himself, but it's limited and then he can't slow enemies which is presumably why he bought it. If he changed Heart -> Skaddi and Diffusal -> BKB, maybe he would have carried correctly. Spectre should rip int heroes to pieces. Recently I've started getting Skaddi instead of Heart on almost every hero I used to build Heart on, and it just works so much better imo. It's such a strong item.

- I see 3 Linken spheres on Sentinel. Pugna's ult has zero second CD, and Spectre dagger goes through Linken and cancels it too, making it a poor decision for this game.

- Omniknight bought Shiva's Guard. Ordinarily this would be a good choice, but the scourge is almost entirely magic damage; your armor is going to be next-to-useless, and the slow aura doesn't even affect the Death Ward (which is the only physical damage, until super pugna hit)

- Rubick bought Shiva's Guard. Now the team only needs one of those anyways since the slow shit doesn't even stack which is 50% of the power of Shiva. Why a rubick would have one of those to begin with is beyond me, he's not the tank.

- Huskar bought hood of defiance. Is berserker's blood + Rubick aura not enough for you? What would you EVER need 150% magic resistance for? A carry wasted a slot on a 2k gold item and didn't even upgrade it to pipe

- Non-upgraded hood on Mirana. Why does no one upgrade this to pipe, has the recipe been forgotten? He ended the game with enough gold for it.

- On the scourge side: three people made E-Blade but no one made Veil of Discord? It stacks and is just about as strong.

- Four people didn't manage to complete their items in 90 minutes.

Anyone got more? Lol
Also WD ended game with over 10k. L0L.

1) Spectre probably got repel'd every fight so he figured there was no need to get BKB. Scourge should have gotten diffusal, though. Manta wouldn't have helped much. WD would just cast his ulti and Pugna could easily get rid of those illusions. I don't know how much gold he had throughout the game but Radiance 90 minutes into the game is practically useless. It would make a lot more sense for him to sell that and grab some more damage so he could kill those intels before they could get to him.

2) Yeah, Linkens made zero sense. Not to mention Zeus's chain lightning also removes it easily as well.

3) Omni was bad.. but since no diffusal was made, he was at least of some use in casting his repel on Spec. He also has Linkens so basically none of his items are actually capable of making a difference in a fight other than the slow from Shiva.

4) Huskar making Buriza would have made this 10x easier for Sentinel than him getting hood.

5) Mirana is useless and was probably of more use to the Scourge team than Sentinel. I don't see how he could have had any effect in a team fight with those items.

6) Scourge just had the better team. Team 1 theoretically should have won easily but quite obvious they were all below average players while Scourge were at least competent enough. Scourge would have won with far less constraints had Silencer went DPS instead of the typical Silencer build and also, if they had gotten diffusal so repel could be countered while Team 1 would have won if Huskar had just gotten Buriza.

I think any game that goes 90 minutes is silly in some way but this game was just one team having the better counters but because they suck, any advantage they may have is severely limited based on their gameplay. Nothing really to state otherwise.

Astros wrote:5) Mirana is useless and was probably of more use to the Scourge team than Sentinel. I don't see how he could have had any effect in a team fight with those items.

He could disarm pugna!

All good points, Astros.

@Nitromon, I didn't see anyone making fun of you for it, besides suggesting Skaddi on Drow Ranger which is a bad choice because you waste the frost.

Heart is mostly for later supplementing an early armlet and when you have no good use for a frost attack orb... A frost. Attack. Orb.

By the way, despite all the faults of sentinel team, it's still almost criminal for silencer not to build carry items.

That's true, Husk is a good Heart user since his skills involve damaging himself and that lets him heal out of combat.

Skadi and Satanic are better items for man fighting ie: sven, huskar, phantom assassin, terrorblade with satanic are meant to fight in your face, because their damage is burst based (kill you quickly and efficiently), lifesteal provides good trading and the active let's you heal quickly. Heart is better for fights that tend to prolong over many seconds or even minutes, or for pushing HG. Illusion heroes benefit a lot from skadi due to providing +damage from agi, armor, IAS, but also HP, but they also do well with Heart because they give much added tankiness to said illusions and can regen back to full in little time. Spec, pl, naga siren and many others due well with Heart as well as skadi. Sometimes you do not have the luxury of getting both Skadi and Heart, so situationally heart may be better, or vice versa. Do not make the assumption "all heroes who do well with heart, do even better with skadi", cuz this is retarded and looking at the game in a vacuum or a 1v1, not a 5v5. The extra hp from heart would save u from a 5 man initiation with hex, that skadi would not. Build what helps you win the game.

Edgeofchaos wrote:besides suggesting Skaddi on Drow Ranger which is a bad choice because you waste the frost.

Haha, though I don't play Drow anymore, I stand by it. But frost is definitely a plus for skadi b/c it can be stacked with lifesteal, dif, and moljonir. Anyone know if it stacks with desolator? Also, anyone know if it still stacks with Clinkz flame arrow? In one previous version it did and it was awesome.

So many times people overlook frost as a viable counter for agil DPS heroes. Say a PA in the game, most players suggest getting heart to tank the crit. I always thought you probably want the frost from skadi to slow her IAS. Skadi + basher + satanic is good counter for any heavy IAS DPS opponents - PA, husk, naix, SK, SB, etc... I'm assuming using another melee agil such as Spectre, SA, BH, or maybe even SB.

I guess of course depending on heroes and situation, you want to choose skadi, heart, or satanic. Heart really is for tanks that just want to stand there with BM or something, I guess Centaur would be a good one. Satanic tanks better if you want to attack b/c of the lifesteal and it gives 5 armor, to tank DPS as well.

Anyone ever tried to build a DPS tank Axe? I don't play Axe regularly, but I have tried this build before. It is again a "theoretical" build. Axe runs out of steam mid-late game to tanks and DPS heroes. I've always thought it makes more sense to build him with Satanic + crit and Skadi to tank instead of heart and BM. It's basically a PA build more or less, and PA tanks well with that crit. I'd sacrifice the blink for a Lothar for the damage + IAS (though blink might still be a better choice, harder to counter). Same game play, you get into the enemy and you call. With call's armor and helix, you do massive damage with your IAS and crit, while tanking with the 25% lifesteal from Satanic. Once call diminishes, you turn on unholy rage and jump the lifeteal to 175% and tank more while attacking an opponent. The frost prevents them from getting away and if his allies attack you, it increase helix %, all the while you get lifesteal with your crit and satanic.

If Axe players want to give it a try, preciate if you post a replay.
- BoT, Skadi, Crit, Satanic, Lothar/blink, last item... heart for more tank, BM if you still want a more traditional start, cuirass/buttefly both good for tanking and IAS, or more damage items MKB for evasion PA/Void or even fury for AOE to your crit damage.. Anything goes, really.

Stop giving wrong advice about Axe people will only get worse. Axe is meant to be tank if you have team to do damage for you, not fighter. Otherwise you go bruiser if you have to do everything by yourself. You go : Boots, Dagger, Dagon, Spectre, Bm, Ethereal. Last 2 items are situational.

Go here and ready my post viewtopic.php?f=62&t=138246&p=535573#p535573 on page 3 to help you remember how axe should be played or go play techie dagger strategy instead if you think you can kill an.. 1 2 3 boom headshot you already got rekted by trying to beat an fool with Crit+Sata axe. Show me an proof first that someone can play Axe like that with over 20 kills and then give people advice.