Geo Daggerless Build

[EdgeOfChaos]

Here's how to pubstomp using geo, without the dagger early build. I'll learn this sometime, but for now this current build suits me fine.

First, a big misconception:
Geomancer is not a "lategamer" or "hard carry". If you are Geo and a true lategamer gets 6-slotted, you are probably finished. Geo can never stand up to hardcarries like Stealth Assassin, Phantom Assassin, Rogue Knight, etc.
Geo is a midgame hero. The true strength of the Geomancer is to outfarm and outlevel your opponents. Not even Alchemist can keep up with a Geomancer's farm in the midgame. This allows you to hit incredibly hard in the 20-30 minute mark, so hard that the enemies will not be able to recover from it before the game is over.
Geomancer is not a weak laner. You can first blood an unexpecting enemy as early as level 3.

So. How-to:
Laning phase
Take solo mid. If your allies don't give you solo mid, call them noobs and leave the game.
Learn poof. Geomancer's base attack power is pathetic and he's susceptible to harass, so use poof to CS when possible. The purpose of the laning phase is to farm your boots of travel. If your allies didn't place wards, call them noobs and place your own. You need wards as geo, it is absolutely not optional. If you don't know how to ward or don't want to, don't pick geo.

Get as much CS as you can while not dying. Get 1 poof, 1 earthbind, then ulti. Using this, you can FB an arrogant enemy. If they are under your tower, throw bind on them twice and they are now dead. Same thing if you get your allies to gank. I usually use only one meepo to CS, which is the one that the enemy harasses; then I move it back to base and heal, and start CSing with the other meepo. You can also send this meepo to collect runes or stack creeps if you feel like it.

When you hit level 7, max your poof. Now you can one shot waves of creeps. This is incredibly useful. When the enemy mid leaves to go gank, run past the tower and poof away creep waves. You will easily tower mid. Optionally, go gank vulnerable enemy heroes using poof.

Hopefully you farm boots of travel within 10 minutes, preferably in 5.

Farming Phase

Laning phase is behind you, you have BoT. At this point in the game, there will usually be a lane that is empty. Take the opportunity to poof away 1-2 creep waves, then teleport away. Make sure it's safe; you'll know it's safe if your wards do not detect any enemies. If the enemies are on all the lanes, go jungle.

Each additional level of ulti gives another boots of travel and increases the amount you can farm. The next item you want is Aghanims. This grants another meepo, but more importantly 100% stat sharing so your clones don't melt. At this point, you should help allies who are in danger, but not run into certain death for them.

Make Skaddi ASAP after Aghs.

Meepo battle tactics

By the time you're fighting, you should have max poof, a couple points in both earthbind/geostrike, and 2-3 meepos. Chain earthbinds on the enemies, bait the stuns or let your allies take them, run in and poof. 4 poofs is enough to melt any non tank.

If the enemies are focusing down a single meepo, then you need to micro a little. First, order all meepos to attack the people chasing you. Then, retreat with the lowest meepo. Geostrike slows them down to nothing, and if you get lucky they'll keep trying to run through it and die. Try to escape huge AOEs if possible, but if you do end up eating them, try to lower/take down a few enemies with poof.

When meepo dies, buy back immediately. Meepo does not have gold buyback restriction. You are always worth more alive than waiting out the death timer.

Midgame

By now you should have BoT/Aghs/Skaddi and 5 meepos. Hardly anything can stand up to you now, so it's time to take a rax. Gather your team as best you can. Take rosh first; use smoke of deceit if you are worried about enemy wards. Get enough gold for buyback. Now you have 3 lives. Lead your team into battle. First, take any non-base towers that still remain (there shouldn't be many). Gank if possible, and push to rax. Do not be afraid of tanking and dying. Use your aegis, then die normally, then buy back and return. If you do it right, your team should be able to take at least a tower if not a rax.

Continue farming and move on to the situational items. Here are some questions to ask yourself:

Do the enemies have a Sven, Xin, Magnus, Enigma, or Leshrac?
Make Hex. Hex them before they get their skill off.

Am I dying too fast to non-geo-counters to contribute?
Make more Skaddis. They add like 2k life.

Am I not dealing enough damage to cut through big tanks?
Make an eblade. It gives some nice agility.

Can I not even reach the enemies before they kill me?
Make a dagger. It's not hard to use when you already have your skaddi.

Now, continue pushing. Constantly be pushing and killing when possible. You are the strongest presence on the field, you need to act like it. Don't be scared of going in 1v2, or even 1v3. Encourage your team to push with you, since you *can't* do everything alone.

Keep in mind - poof never becomes bad. That's over 1000 big area damage. That's more than most heroes' 100sec CD ultis will do, and its with a 6 second CD and irrelevant manacost. This can shred armor-stackers.

Hopefully with enough pushes you finish all the rax. If you don't, you'll go into late game and at that point, you're very reliant on your team's hardcarries. You're still a good battle presence, but no more 1v3s for you.

Rejected garbage items
Mekanism - I see newbie geos go this all the time. I don't know who they're learning this build from. Geo is a killer, not a healer.
Vlads - Another item I see all the time. You really think lifesteal is worth delaying your core by another 5 minutes? You aren't a carry. IF AT ALL, this should be a 7th item put on your courier but if it's that lategame you're in trouble anyways.
Boots that Aren't Travels - Throw those power treads away. Mobility is the entire point of geomacer, don't waste it.
Any item that only benefits main - BKB, Buriza, MKB, Battlefury... These are all great carry items, just not geo items.

Maybe items
I don't get these but they wouldn't be total garbage: AC, Pipe, Shivas

Special hero mentions
Huskar: this is your worst nightmare as a mid geomancer. So bad you may even want to swap lanes. Geo has no real response to this hero. Can't kill it, can't run. Not such an issue lategame.
Necrolyte: if any of your geos get below half, you're good as dead and you can't buy back.
Magnus: luckily everyone sucks with this hero but a good one can easily kill you.
Sven: hex is required. hope he doesn't bkb.
Enigma: hex is required.
Xin: hex+dagger is required. Fist can literally one shot you.
Lich: people think this counters geo, so they pick it instead of real geo counters. Earlygame, split geos. Later, tank it, you have 5000 HP.
Earthshaker: much more of a counter because of the stunning potential. It is possible to tank him.
Riki: your worst mid-lategame nightmare. You have no response to the cloud since you can't MKB. He easily shreds a geo who he targets.
Mortred: much the same, miss 50% of attacks.
Slark: you counter this little frog hard. Surround him so he can't leap, geostrike him, and poof. Shadowdance won't protect him.

Conclusion
Meepo is, in my opinion, the absolute best hero in the game. His ability to snowball out of control and do a one-man-team build makes him potent at carrying dead weight players, and so is my #1 pick for anti-stacking.

I have personally achieved about 95% winrate with this strategy, without teamswapping or dodging games. Those losses, I fully admit, were times I got outplayed hard, especially when the enemies pick 5 Geo counters. Even then, you can do a lot better than me with this hero; my skill with it isn't even close to memaru's.

The power and skill ceiling here makes it a very nice hero to main.

[Frank]

What are your thoughts on lc/axe with a pms mid vs geo mid and what about clockwerk cogging the creep waves level 1 mid ? I dont play geo on dota 1 but arent 2-3 casual wraith bands very slot effective early game ? Also that byuback bug is really bs ontop of the already reduced respawn rate that he already has in this version.

[EdgeOfChaos]

LC or Axe against a Geo can go either way. It really is a pure match of micromanagement.

As a Meepo: when I go against a LC, I go in for maybe 1 attack while LC hits creeps, when LC target switches to me I get back. If done correctly, he will waste his moments of courage chasing and not heal. Then when he gets low, I head in for the kill with poof. However on the other side, if I get outplayed the LC may be able to totally cut off my farm and then kill me at 6, especially if he micros his hero correctly to land all his MoCs.

My experience with going against LC mid has been generally positive. I've killed plenty of them, but I've been killed too. On the other hand, 50%+ of pub game meepos don't understand how to micro multiple units and it's easy to win mid then.

Cutting in front of the tower makes you EXTREMELY vulnerable to ganks, as in a free kill if you don't have wards. Put together that every single AP game has a Bara in it, I would personally not feel safe cutting the creeps as a LC/Axe vs a disable+nuke hero like Meepo.

Cog, Tree, Fissure on creeps isn't a smart idea really. All you do is mess up creep equilibrium, and meepo is really good at CSing under a tower. Not only that, you spent half your mana pool on a mana intensive hero. Note that clock can easily firstblood using assault and therefore imo you should basically always get that level 1.

Wraith band build: you're dropping 700 into throwaway stat items before you have stat sharing. Not sure if I'd do that. I suppose if you want to do a bunch of early fighting.. but my geo is all about avoiding difficult fights and hitting core items ASAP, so that my midgame power is maximized. Killing heroes is slower than farming creeps for Meepo.
Buyback is intended, not a bug. And yeah it's super strong . Even after dying after buyback at lvl25, you're down for at most 60 seconds where other heroes would be down 100+.

In fact, meepo has all sorts of little invisible bonuses.. -30% revive time, no buyback restrictions are the known ones. But did you know that he has extra base magic resist too?

[Frank]

Cog actually stops the creeps completely they just stand there after cogs are done. And with a bit of blocking u can cog the whole wave. How is getting gold after buying back intended when everyother hero is restricted?

[EdgeOfChaos]

Recovering easily from death is one of meepos things.
That's why we get super short respawn times too.

Idk, maybe cog is worth it. Not sure tbh. I wouldn't be concerned if it happened in my game.

[corey2013]

When your names Frank and you spend 6 months grinding to 4k solo mmr on dota 2, only to go back to shitty dota 1 (not real dota) so you can feel like a god again to the incompetent 45 year olds who still play it. -Lemon (Founder of Team Fruit) aka Evil.Lemon (dota 1 legend)

[Dhamma]

LMAO the legendary stacker, lemon lol. You'll never see him in a game unless he has 3 others to carry him. XD

Anyways, back on point.

The BB 'no gold loss' thing is a bug, there's no doubt about it. Reduced revive time is intentional. It's been said that geo has additional magic resistance, i never looked into it.

Cogs blocking will have no long term effect, geo can just farm them a few minutes later. With double poof he will have a higher chance of CSing them.

LC can be a problem or not, it depends on too many factors. Mainly if he snowballs. Axe can be a problem early. Later it depends on his play and items.

There are other heroes that could potentially be problematic that haven't been mentioned. Though its more of who's playing the hero, and not the hero itself, probably. I've even seen razr do well vs geo, but never had a problem with one.


There is a faster way to farm mid, but I won't mention it now. I might divulge it and a few of my strategies before retire around Q1 next year.

[EdgeOfChaos]

I'll need to see proof from the maker that it's a bug, almost positive it's on purpose. There are lots of little 'invisible' geo bonuses given.

Agree with your statement on cogs.

I've heard it said that any hero counters geo, and geo counters any hero.
Oversimplified of course, but surprisingly accurate.

Faster way to farm mid.. well, there's:
1) Straight double poof (what I do)
2) Farm + Stack Neutrals
3) Farm + Pull creeps from another lane using poof
In order of what I want to do on lane.
My geo is all about safety. Running past a tier 2 tower to pull creeps is an easy gank opening, but I guess it's cool if you can do it.

[Dhamma]

There should be a change log you can check in the dota 2 wiki for geo. I can't check while I'm at work. The changes on d1 and d2 should have been the same at this point.

You are accurate about the farm, but there is a small trick in addition, that is possible to execute.

3) Farm + Pull creeps from another lane using poof

Funny you mentioned this. I think nabo banned someone for this as bug abuse. In dota 2 creeps don't behave the same way so it doesn't work. I usually don't really do this purposely, although it does happen. It's bad practice to deny your team farm.
I saw stormshield do it all the time, he would tp where allies are farming and take the farm. I try to avoid it now and farm elsewhere.

[jfaller1]

playing dota 1 in 2017 and actually trying hard means a few things. 1) you suck at dota 2 and cant hang so you pretend to be good on a server full of below average players here. 2) your comp sucks and you are poor. 3) you may be a serial killer. 4) you have to play EM or a shitty IH league with terrible players to feel good about yourself. Ive seen clan BBA ih games and its a 5v5 clown fest. 5 animals vs 5 animals. oh and BTW #Evil.Lemon is and always will be the number 1 player on ENT. hands down. if anyone has anything to say feel free to 1v1 the kid on dota 2. he stomped frank and will stomp anyone else. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... buybck.png

[corey2013]

where tha homie franklin (Frank) at?? This dude fell in love with a chick named bayleigh in our dota 2 discord, and she literally turned out to be a guy using a voice changer and frank just INSTA falls back down to dota 1. Sad story boyz, sad story.

[EdgeOfChaos]

Funny you mentioned this. I think nabo banned someone for this as bug abuse. In dota 2 creeps don't behave the same way so it doesn't work. I usually don't really do this purposely, although it does happen. It's bad practice to deny your team farm.

It's absolutely not bug abuse rofl.
I do think it's a silly tactic.
Stormshield got 1 year for dodging an autoban too. Classic.

where tha homie franklin (Frank) at?? This dude fell in love with a chick named bayleigh in our dota 2 discord, and she literally turned out to be a guy using a voice changer and frank just INSTA falls back down to dota 1. Sad story boyz, sad story.

No shame in falling for a Trap, it happens to the best of us. You can always add to this: http://anime-traps.wikia.com/wiki/Anime_traps_Wiki

Were you secretly the trap, lemons?

[jfaller1]

hugmeonce took a 14 year old to lunch

[memaru]

playing dota 1 in 2017 and actually trying hard means a few things. 1) you suck at dota 2 and cant hang so you pretend to be good on a server full of below average players here. 2) your comp sucks and you are poor. 3) you may be a serial killer. 4) you have to play EM or a shitty IH league with terrible players to feel good about yourself. Ive seen clan BBA ih games and its a 5v5 clown fest. 5 animals vs 5 animals. oh and BTW #Evil.Lemon is and always will be the number 1 player on ENT. hands down. if anyone has anything to say feel free to 1v1 the kid on dota 2. he stomped frank and will stomp anyone else. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... buybck.png

1v1 FailFish

[divinerape]

What are your thoughts on lc/axe with a pms mid vs geo mid and what about clockwerk cogging the creep waves level 1 mid ? I dont play geo on dota 1 but arent 2-3 casual wraith bands very slot effective early game ? Also that byuback bug is really bs ontop of the already reduced respawn rate that he already has in this version.

1v1 axe beats geo mid every time. The only issue is that geos cry for a gank immediately and once axe dies 1-2 times it's not that easy anymore
Considering no one in ENT calls lanes... you get the point