Finalized LIHL Reform

[eldryan]

@Diablo_
"There's a perfectly fine suggestion from me (and godlike) in the admin forum, every rule break wll be punished by a fixed ban length varying from rule to rule and every offence increases the ban length for future bans in the next x months by a certain time. "
Wrong. This was suggested well before you were mod, including by me in this thread (2 seasons being the certain time), and by me in the admin forum. However, it is not exclusive with this suggestion of PPS, and both should be taken into account - breaking two different offenses shouldn't be allowed to go unpunished just because a player diversified his rule break portfolio. Because you've only abused anti-stuck 100 times, doesn't mean you have a clean slate in your punishment for pulling other lanes offenses or rage quit offenses.

Pulling also happens by accident quite often, and has varying degrees of severity. In the current system as well, we have a "warning" phase - this is just an objective warning phase that goes up to 10 points and reveals the flaws in this whole ideology which you yourself have used. Obviously, if there is a severe rule break the points added can vary. However, giving warnings to obviously intentional and malicious rule breaks of the type you guys are outlining ("exploits") shouldn't be treated as a "light" offense eg. unintentional healing.

The system isn't definitively flawed, but it can and should be improved.

[aRt)Y]

you haven't outlined the mechanics of the new dc system

Do you mean the PES? Could you specify which parts you want to have elaborated?

Off topic:

don't try to hide the flaws by just responding by jumping on details.

I simply corrected your statement as you dont seem to comprehend how our suggested idea works - how dare I, sorry.

The system isn't definitively flawed, but it can and should be improved.

Any ideas/suggestions? I am not sure whether adding actual unvouches to it will improve or worsen it as the complexity will increase, too. Furthermore, and that's something no one has mentioned thus far, we did not decide to add unvouches due to the activity. We tried to cover the fear of inactivity and transparency by enforcing fixed penalty points to avoid bias claims in whatever the mods do.

Going back to the old way we dealt with ban requests is no solution either as I grew tired of mods being publicly insulted and questioned for whatever reason the players felt for. Either you guys learn to respect the final decisions of the mods or you dont; but then we will have to find ways to avoid these situations.

Not sure what to think about this... I´d say its good overall, the negative part about this is that there is a sportsmanship rule kind of in lihl, when it comes to for example dcs, most of the dcs are not even reported, because dcs are very uncommon by most players. This change will probably lead to more dc reports and maybe other stuff

I do highly question LIHL's "sportsmanship" if it gets ruined by the opportunity to anonymously report someone. You make it more sound like they would be afraid of doing it publicly because they thereby "violate" this weird codex and get flamed for it. If LIHL is so great as you claim, there shouldn't be an issue trusting the players; because you know.. the codex.

While I do understand that we've to ensure there are no ways to exploit rules or systems, I am slightly shocked that everyone is that focused on it. Seems more like NWU after all if you can't play by mostly simply rules. Perhaps something with your codex ain't right, eh? The point of the reform is not to create a second Alcatraz to teach teens how to behave properly but rather make it more fun, less unvouched days, true elo, etc. But ye, I know your comments.

[Krumme]

If we are not to be harsh in our judging of this reform now, when should we. I prefer being sceptic and criticizing now rather than later. This reform is truly a breath of fresh air and changes alot of things that makes it somewhat easier being a mod, but this new reform has been hyped from your end throughout the last month so we are trying to help you perfect it.
You may be rigth regarding the sportsmanship or lack of same but if we start acting like we don't care about sportsmanship and each other it will probably go downhill real quick in this league, so I don't mind tunnel visioning on sportsmanship as one of the pillars in this community.
Even though less unvouched days is a good thing it's not a good thing if the rules broken increases aswell - not worth it.

[nabo.]

Only few lihl players have commented in this topic, but remember that these suggestions are based on the survey votes and feedbacks we have received. Some of your criticisms and concerns are reasonable, but it is also true that our suggestion is not something we have come up out of thin air for nothing. There is nothing wrong with trying out a new model to moderate this league. Fact is this league's moderation needed something and something had to be done. Changes from now may turn out well or may not turn out as well as we planned. Whatever the case, we have yet to even try any of our suggestions in practice. Just remember that we only have good intentions for this community.

A lot of the problems few foresee has to do with players trying to bend the rules and standards and exploiting them for their own selfishness. Sportsmanship is a notable quality, but without respect first, there cannot be sportsmanship between one another.

This aint a pub. If you guys really want a league with high quality inhouse games, show us you guys have what it takes to create such a place.

IFs are fine. But, whether there will be more ban offenses or not is something you wont know until the next season. We can then see and realize the true nature of this league's players.

[eldryan]

@Art)y It would be more implementable with severity definitions for each punishment, not just the healing king (intentional/unintentional). Example: building green if it happens one level less punishment then doing it all game long.

Typically would have more points added for repeat offenses of same rule violation, Example: anti-stuck first violation 5 days, second 14 days, third 30 days with a three month period to lose one strike.

Supplements well as an addition to bans each time violated the rule is violated.

The addition of a (for the accidental violation cases) points allowance for games played no violations, as AFK, dc, accidental pulling, etc. is something that normally happens once every 100 games.

Also some changes to the points system could definitely be implemented. AFK 2 points, Rage Quit so few points, etc. could all be adjusted to the points recommended as the days banned (each day = 1 point) in the system recommended by iightfyre and myself, mickeythemouse, or diablo_. Even for a more easy to find system, can just look through Enforced Bans archive and notice the averages for each offense based off of severity and go with that. Banning someone 2 days for being AFK when a game starts is just not scalar.

Should also add a better system of criteria for end-of-season unvouches, as the one I recommended got flamed by iightfyre and supersexyy and then resulted in the first of administration getting involved with LIHL, because they were confused with the details and too lazy to read it over. Ditto with MickeytheMouse's system.

Ilocos had some good recommendations for unofficial/official ELOs.

These are the main improvements I would recommend from a brief review. Would have to spend more time on it to come up with more.

[pewpew lasergun]

@Art)y

have you tried to contact lisk the map creator , to add a new mode to the map with no gold from king for the team who leaks.
it would probably eliminate all clog, mass leaking problem.

diablo has his email.

[Diablo_]

Afaik Lisk has no access to the 3.41 version and he probably wouldn't do it anyway since he is busy with Legion TD 2

[aRt)Y]

As the next season is approaching and we make adjustments to the changes, any final comments? :)

[aRt)Y]

As there are no new comments, the topic will be closed.

The last few days we've changed several things and I will post the updated parts tomorrow.