Feature Suggestions / Changes

[Ultrasonic]

@Faldt imagine if titan w8ted for nuke to wear out... thats what i was saying >.> im not a dumbass and even if morph went battle form what if tit was bub and just needed corpses >.> wouldnt he be insta ded?

[Ultrasonic]

,,, im srry for the accident spam im just too lag for posting srry...

[ShadowZz]

@Burn I literally only comment on suggestions that I feel shouldn't be added as I think that simply spam posting "Good idea let's do that" or "Support" is pointless.

As for the suggestion itself your saying that you not getting the lumber base you want due to the builder you picked makes the game imbalanced? I know of 11 good and regularly used lumber bases with equal benefits. That means if everyone in the game picks a builder that needs a lumber base then you would still all get a good one. This is yet again a suggestion that points towards the ID community not being capable of simply talking to one another pre game about where they plan on going.

@Neco Fix communication in Island Defense please, thanks.

Edit: Most of my suggestions or balance discussion goes through skype as you well know Burn

[Burn]

1) Different bases has different benefits, some are better than others.
2) Rather than fix communication, fix imbalance instead.
3) Every single one of suggestion in this thread have been shut down by you. Is that our problem, or yours?

-Burn

[ShadowZz]

@Burn Literally 2 pages ago there is a post with me agreeing with your ideas about buildings staying behind when people leave due to people leaving to prevent feed etc. This is completely off topic and if you want to attack the way I respond to comments that are basically saying " I don't get the base I want so change the game" then feel free to on pm. The entire point of posting suggestions is so people can agree or disagree with them. Not agreeing with every suggestion you make shouldn't cause an issue.

Edit: I'm not the only person disagreeing, I'm simply the only one who can be bothered to keep replying.....

[Burn]

Off topic:
Fair enough, there may be one or more you've agreed to. My mistake. Still though, negative reinforcement is never good in this type of scenarios. Seriously, the disadvantages to most of my suggestions are trivial, whereas the advantages are vast. Isn't this something we can agree on? Why do you have to only focus on the small disadvantages and ignore the advantages? Isn't the whole point of these discussions to discuss both sides? Do I have to list every obvious advantage out so that it is obvious which side outweighs the other?

Advantages of having max. move speed in grace period

1) Builders are balanced in terms of who gets which lumber base.
2) Gives newer players time to setup lumber base so they don't first blood or feed.
3) Less first bloods in the first few minutes of the game.
4) Less mass feeders in the first few minutes of the game.

Disadvantages of having max. move speed in grace period

1) Builders get early wood, which isn't really a disadvantage. This could also be balanced by reducing grace period.

-Burn

[ShadowZz]

Disadvantages:

1) Builders have wood earlier would which would allow them to have there lumber bases walled completely prior to titan coming rather than being caught out early sometime or not with full 4-5 walls.
2) Supports can go make there seed and run back to mound without any delay and have it fully walled before titan spawns.
3) This is an indirect nerf to titan and I'm sure you realize that.
4) First bloods in the start of the game are dictated by people being incapable of staying in there bases and waiting for titan to appear, if anything this will only increase the amount of people running out there lumber bases as titan spawns due to them having wood and lumbers bases finished faster.
5) Builders with teleport would now get to their lumber base faster and be able to straight tp to the now ready walled middle and start golding.
6) Builders like gobo who's panic runs out as he is building his first factories would now be able to finish facs and run back to middle before titan spawns due to speed buff.

As for balance to set up lumber bases I just think it's ridiculous considering there are 24 bases and potentially 6-7 people who need a lumber base each game....

I'm not trying to be negative but there's no point me re listing the positives you already know. You're a smart guy and I see no reason as to why I need to tell you the reasons why you suggested a idea so I simply list the reasons why not. Being mad at people for stealing a lumber base doesn't warrant a balance change lol...

[Burn]

To your list:

1) This is not a disadvantage, this is an advantage. This means newer players get to play instead of dying outright.
2) They can already do this. Refer to 1).
3) This is true, but it's also trivial. Not worth mentioning.
4) No, this is not logical in any way. Please explain further.
5) They can do this already. They also waste a 6 minute CD, this is also not a disadvantage.
6) This is also not a disadvantage, you can already do this.

As for balance I think bases have different advantages/disadvantages and certain bases fit more for personal playstyles.

The problem with your critique, although constructive, is that it's hard to agree with any of your points, which makes it frustrating because you should have had enough games of Island Defense to know that this suggestion will not make it OP for builders in any way.

It really messes with my flow when you list trivial disadvantages that no-one cares about, or outright making stuff up that does not make sense. I feel that unless you really have a proper disadvantage, that these trivial disadvantages can just be ignored to think of how it will benefit island defense game-play in the long run.

"Being mad at people for stealing a lumber base doesn't warrant a balance change lol" -> Why not? Changes are all about balance and spicing up game-play. Getting rid of stupid things like having a Troll WW past you to take your base isn't a reason for a balance change?

-Burn

[Faldt]

@Burn you are talking about "balance changes" but isn't that what does the game to what it is, Some builders have a advantage over other builders.

whats next? could we nerf some builders walls cuz they are better than others?

[ShadowZz]

I agree with @Faldt

Hey look I'm agreeing with a suggestion!

[Haunt]

All towers must have equal range, dmg and speed. All walls should have same hp and armor. All builders should have exact same escape skills, speed, hp armor etc etc

Why not just remove all other builders but murloc, and have only one tit, let's say Granitacles.

Oh wait, that doesn't make game interesting one bit...

[Stealer]

Give every builder max. move speed in grace period so people with charge/panic doesn't steal my bases even though I'm ahead of him

You do realize that your premise for wanting this change is so "people with charge/panic doesn't steal my bases"? Say it out loud a couple times and you'll probably realize why people aren't 100% for it.

Max builder ms is a big issue for titan, having obs a lot of games. People do die from using their escape skills and having them on cooldown. Safer people don't risk golding until their escape skill is back either so it saves titan having a high hp tauren early on.
I can get a tier2 draenei wall by the time titan gets to my initial lumber base, this is only going to get worse if you increase my movement speed because I won't waste as much time waiting to get to the lumber base to place another pool or shelter. As well as I can pick a farther lumber base which makes it even harder on titan. (Getting around the map is just as hard for titan).
Supports will also be able to seed & get to mound. I'm like 12-1 with playing as a Satyr and denning middle. If you remove out early deaths both numbers go down (which gives 0 losses). It is a small sample, but having a walled out middle early on really makes it harder to kill people via ww even outside of the mound.
Noobs have no clue what they are doing, if you increase their movement speed some of it will be used to make a lumber base faster but also some will be used to make a lumber base next to middle or to walk back and forth. I don't see how movement speed is suddenly going to fix players not knowing how to play.

Finally, why is it your base? You weren't the first builder ever to play. You aren't the map creater and able to add a flag saying 'Burn Lumber Base'? Your premise is flawed.



----
Most of us don't see the reason for builders to be equal or really want it. This is also why you get flak for the morphling suggestion.
Given how powerful morph is (towers + beast + innate 150+400 magic hp warrior) I don't see any reason to buff his early game and personally I'd rather morph be stronger than more survival-y.

[Burn]

Then make grace period shorter. This is already part of the suggestion, and will fix most of your complaints for this suggestion. Hell, instead of crying about how bad the suggestion is, you can try to think about obvious improvements to the problem like making all builder speed same speed in grace period, be it max. move or the same speed as any other builder.

It is only a problem when I am NEARLY there but a murloc/dryad/Troll WW or panics over me like an ass. If Neco doesn't think this is a problem, then I won't discuss any further. I don't think you understand where I'm coming from seeing as you guys really think I am mad because people "steal" my burn base. It's a problem for everyone, not just me.

Off topic:
Your Morphling point is also off-topic, if you have looked closely at my posts, you'd notice that I also suggested to make morph towers weaker.

Obviously it wouldn't matter if I had max speed or not if he is first. The problem is him not being ahead of me, and using panic/WW to catch up and take my base, forcing me to go somewhere else which could potentially make me feed because I will lose time in grace period.

It's also hard to believe if Neco makes this change and you was not aware of the planning phase, you would be like: "OMG this change is so OP it needs to be removed, the max. move speed is way too unbalanced". No. Most players will think that the change improved gameplay for builder and some will even realise it was implemented to balance how slower builders will now have the option to choose whichever base he wants.

-Burn

[narbtit]

o man this is good drama!
FFA mode. I'm good enough on my own that I don't really care about other builders that much, so I'd like an ffa mode with the option to ally/vision someone.
I think it would add balance to the game as titan is pretty underpowered, and it would let people do some fun killing.

I'm just remembering the days when this one guy hosted ID with listchecker, or something, this hoster that didn't have banlist. And I friended him, and I would make a new account each game. At gp each game, I would tk his merch. I had to change my personality as well, because if anyone acted cocky or too friendly to get in his base, he'd be really paranoid/suspiciuos. So I'd just quietly hang around until gp, then a move his merch. Either with builder, or if across the maps, with summons. Once I killed it with upgraded gob hunter, so nice long range.

[Merex]

An FFA mode in a survival game.. You do realize that if there's such a mode, it won't only be basing that'll be impossible. How do you gold successfully? There's only 4 build-able paths with a titan who outruns builders and 10 other ''enemies'' who cherish the same greed. How would you get lumber if someone just magically strolls past your lb and thinks ''oh hey, I think I'll kill all his harvesters''. You want an FFA mode where it's already hard enough to base alone with a decent titan and have a 50% possibility of everything you own being destroyed by random builder.

The only real plus side to having this mode is if titan was deactivated during it and just had the option of being a builder but even then, everyone will just be to themselves or fight with each-other at the gold mound and it will ruin what ID was initially made for.