Suggestion: 2s

[smokedope123]

As there is some "drama" going on about this.

Why not just make it so that we are able to sign to a 2s or a 4s at the same time. No one will block anyone, nor anyone has to wait for the other game to start and people will just sign to the lobby they want to.

@Diablo_ should be possible to implement without a lot of work, right?

@all Anything that speaks against this?

[HazarDous]

We used to have it that way with battle.net bot, I can't remember any major inconvenient.

[Crey]

I think its the best idea how to do it for both 2s and 4s atm.

[FadingSuns]

Theres one reason of why we avided this on past. And it was because it was used commonly to skip lobbies or snipe ppl. Examples:

1) (this was 1007 specialty): many times we had 7 ppl signed, some ppl get tired of wait and start a 2s, then everyone unsigns fast and sign 2s. Everyone joins the 2s and swaps are done, ending on 2 ppl sniped, might be that even ppl that wasnt signed originally are swapped in into the 2s game, making it a 4s game at the end, u could be signed 30 min for a 4s and u cant play that 2s game that was converted into a 3s/4s. And that is pure bs.

2) There are 6 ppl signed for a 4s, u and ur friends wanna play on same lobby so u start a 2s and make swaps to get ur 7 friends in game, sniping anyone that was signed for 4s.

3) u hate a given player and he is signed for the 4s, so u start a 2s and swap in all except that guy (that also joined game to be swapped in) because the rule says if someone disagree with an obs being swaped he cnt be swapped.

All of this goes against lihl spirit, in lihl u are supposed to play with ANY vouched player, in lihl its supposed to be a competitive league that is all vs all with random+balanced teams.

Basically my view has been always the same, if u wanna play a certain lobby with certain ppl in ur team, lihl is not the place for it, go 1200 or host a private (non lihl) game.

Everything i said happened more than often, was not isolated cases, and were extremely hard to judge/track. Its gona happen again im sure if u implement this solution.

Perhaps the rule needs to be changed. It should not be possible to veto swap a given obs, u can veto swap obs in general, ok, but should never be possible to veto one single obs to be swaped but allow another one, that goes clearly vs lihl spirit on my view.

Also it will go against the fluency of games, mny tines u got singed 6/8 to 4s nd 3/4 to 2s, making not any lobbu start for ages.

If we force that only 1 game can be started at the same time, we will for sure benefit the fluency of games.

All in all, i can see many cons to this solution and i think u should take them all in consideration before do such a step.

[FadingSuns]

maybe we should put no obs on 2s, or make it only to have red teal yellow green colors available, avoiding any kind of swap/snipe tactics when a 2s is hosted.

[BoretkPanda]

more important: split 2s 4s elo

[Jamo]

more important: split 2s 4s elo

This won't happen as stated in the other thread.

[MudMan]

Just make 2s unranked
its a fun mode that is HEAVILY dependent on luck and clearly the game mechanics/balances are done according to 4v4 (maybe 3v3) games

[BoretkPanda]

Just make 2s unranked
its a fun mode that is HEAVILY dependent on luck and clearly the game mechanics/balances are done according to 4v4 (maybe 3v3) games

beware of stacking hazard when sayin sth like that

[archol]

Heres a good example how funny, demanding and hard a 2s can be and how different it is compared to the standard 4s, which is actually nearly always the same proccedure.

https://entgaming.net/findstats.php?id=11008058

Its really unfair that 2s is so negative perceived, while 4s is way more boring in my opinion as its mainly always the same.

[smokedope123]

Can we try to keep it on topic, instead of making different suggestions. Doesn't belong here.

Thanks for your input Ace, and I understand some of your concerns, but I believe it has more positive things to it. I might agree however that a 2s lobby should not be abused to start a 4s game. Maybe we could make a rule, that a 2s lobby may only start as a 2s or 3s games, would leave people the option to obs if they wish however. Another attempt would be, 2s may only start as a 2s if there is a 4s lobby trying to gather players.

[Meshtar]

Make it possible to start 2s and 4s separately and no obs in 2s to avoid sniping. Ah ye, also make 2s give no elo as stated before

[archol]

Sorry that im posting here than creating another topic, will be my last posting regarding that. Heres another example how a 2s can turn out - despite outroll and immo and thorn at our side

https://entgaming.net/findstats.php?id=11012745

West (Fiji/Bigm) had archer/mutants/griffin/witch doc and ygg/druids/mutant/troll/turrets vs East (me/da_pwnerer) ghost from my first roll/mudman/alpha/griffin and spawn/druid and rerolled mutants after arena, and we would win the 17 race if i didnt fuck up the kingcontroll on 9, which resulted on a heal lost.

So how many of you would give up already or say we cant win due that? There were enough situation, where people won despite this odds (saber/ warchief vs archer/sea giant and malf/sea giant - and we won easy on 17 few days ago)