Now ID community has literally dropped its value......
goood hand full is left....
Any good ideas to either bring back people or recruit users???
Any suggestion is good,
I have 3 nephews and I plan to get them hooked on island defense for future...
ITs truly dying...
- Panopticon
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Re: ITs truly dying...
It's not dead, we just play on battle.net rather than wc3connect, not to mention most of our games are over the weekends now.
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Re: ITs truly dying...
road-kill wrote:Now ID community has literally dropped its value......
goood hand full is left....
Any good ideas to either bring back people or recruit users???
Any suggestion is good,
I have 3 nephews and I plan to get them hooked on island defense for future...
If you play on the live servers there are games hosted over the weekend. Most of us don't have time to play during the week because the regulars all work or go to college.
Just hop over to the Azeroth discord and we're all still around!
Edit: Hoogies you're literally in the League, wtf you talking about the game being dead for.
"Sura is a God dude, like for real."
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
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Re: ITs truly dying...
Wait what? Does ENT only use WC3Connect now? What kinda b.net bullshit is this? I'm sure that's not helping popularity.
-Burn
Blizzard has blocked several of our host bots from Battle.net. Because the upcoming 1.30.2 patch will anyway break support for joining our games from Battle.net, we will not be investigating this block further.
To continue playing on ENT and MMH, please use WC3Connect, a desktop application that allows you to easily join custom WC3 games.
Get WC3Connect here.
-Burn
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Re: ITs truly dying...
Burn wrote:Wait what? Does ENT only use WC3Connect now? What kinda b.net bullshit is this? I'm sure that's not helping popularity.Blizzard has blocked several of our host bots from Battle.net. Because the upcoming 1.30.2 patch will anyway break support for joining our games from Battle.net, we will not be investigating this block further.
To continue playing on ENT and MMH, please use WC3Connect, a desktop application that allows you to easily join custom WC3 games.
Get WC3Connect here.
-Burn
Bots no longer work on the live patch, and Blizzard "banned" (I call BS on that one) ENT's CD keys. Meaning they were forced to develop a private server or shut down. They chose not to shut down and advertise the private server heavily, which is why the bots got banned.
Also @Lynx ID is still alive and well on the live servers, I see 10-20 games a day hosted by different people, all of which tend to fill within a few minutes. Plus as mentioned above, we still have the "League / In-house" games on the weekends.
"Sura is a God dude, like for real."
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
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Re: ITs truly dying...
Nice to hear, just think ID would grow if 309d or a prior version of ID was popular no offense to dragon or remixer I think they are improving on necos pos version where neco made builders and titans homogeneous.
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Re: ITs truly dying...
Lynx wrote:Nice to hear, just think ID would grow if 309d or a prior version of ID was popular no offense to dragon or remixer I think they are improving on necos pos version where neco made builders and titans homogeneous.
"The editors are improving on the current map."
"The game would be popular if a prior version was popular."
u wut m8?
Pick one.
"Sura is a God dude, like for real."
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
-Burn/Timmy/Avion
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Re: ITs truly dying...
Lynx is trying to say our current editors are better than Neco who did a great job on 309d, but the big changes in 4.x.x killed the game for many veterans, including the two main 309d clans, StiD and BTI. That's just a theory though. It could just be that b.net is getting outdated in general or other reasons, but IMO that's just an excuse, because when comparing ID to other games such as LTD, WC3Ladder and WC3DoTA, these other games didn't suffer the same popularity drop. Imo WC3 still serves a niche, still being the best game to support content creators to make custom games. For example, SC2ID is trash compared to wc3id, and Dota2id didn't even make it to release because the dota2 custom game support was just utter trash.
Note: I am a little outdated with the current META, but I'll try to explain things from my point of view from August 2015 to around May 2018. Starting from BTI Grunt inhouses or ENT weekly inhouse league which I regard as the best inhouses in ID history..to now, where pubs are pretty much dead, and inhouses are scarce and filled with less experienced players who most won't even get vouched for the ENT inhouses.
Having said all that, I'd like to name a few reasons for ID dying so that we as an ID community won't make the same mistake again and try to push changes together in the right direction.
Now that I've shared the reasons on where I think ID went wrong (because I don't want future editors to make the same mistake), I'll try to end on a more positive note and suggest some general ideas on which direction ID should be going. I have made such points before which is why I didn't lead with them, but I think it's important to reiterate and reinforce my views especially for newer readers. Remixer and iamadragon are well aware of my stance, and have co-operated a lot with me when I was still active, which I am very grateful for. Imo I don't think it's too late for ID, I think ID still serves a niche of a well-made survival PvP tower defense game.
EDIT:
8) To top it all off, I would like to refer to this graph here: https://i.imgur.com/67oYfMl.jpg
8a) A decent titan playing as a titan against a normal decent lobby is actually pretty good, if it's too challenging, they can make a smurf and stomp pubs to enter the "flower channel", as shown in the above graph. If it is a shit lobby, stomping the pubs isn't too bad now that builders get banned for leaving early.
8b) For a new titan player, they get stomped or has nothing to do for 30 minutes and ends up stalling, which ends up being boring for new players (This isn't part of the graph).
8c) For a high-skill builder focusing on having fun it's still pretty good, according to the graph, you can choose your own challenge level to make sure you're in the flow channel.
8d) For a high-skill builder focusing on winning (tryhard style):
- Collect 45g then double or triple base when you have enough wood (g2l any extra gold). (VERY BAD, BORING)
- Stall the titan, denying feed and wasting the titan's time by making the titan chase you, saving team-mates and giving back minimal feed. Then farm up a fuckload of wood and gold then base when you're 99% sure your base will hold. (my preferred playstyle, you choose your challenge level to be inside the flow channel. If you die too much then just tone down the risk level.)
- Bonus: Thing about these two playstyles is that it's complete dogshit if it's a decent titan who stomps lobbies on alts or abuses ethereal mirror to stomp 99.99% of his games (coco)
8e) For a noob builder focusing on having fun - I'll be honest, I think it's pretty shitty. You go in and you feed the titan or die and have no fun. It needs to be easier to play/learn for noobs.
-Burn
Note: I am a little outdated with the current META, but I'll try to explain things from my point of view from August 2015 to around May 2018. Starting from BTI Grunt inhouses or ENT weekly inhouse league which I regard as the best inhouses in ID history..to now, where pubs are pretty much dead, and inhouses are scarce and filled with less experienced players who most won't even get vouched for the ENT inhouses.
Having said all that, I'd like to name a few reasons for ID dying so that we as an ID community won't make the same mistake again and try to push changes together in the right direction.
Spoiler!
Now that I've shared the reasons on where I think ID went wrong (because I don't want future editors to make the same mistake), I'll try to end on a more positive note and suggest some general ideas on which direction ID should be going. I have made such points before which is why I didn't lead with them, but I think it's important to reiterate and reinforce my views especially for newer readers. Remixer and iamadragon are well aware of my stance, and have co-operated a lot with me when I was still active, which I am very grateful for. Imo I don't think it's too late for ID, I think ID still serves a niche of a well-made survival PvP tower defense game.
Spoiler!
EDIT:
8) To top it all off, I would like to refer to this graph here: https://i.imgur.com/67oYfMl.jpg
Spoiler!
8a) A decent titan playing as a titan against a normal decent lobby is actually pretty good, if it's too challenging, they can make a smurf and stomp pubs to enter the "flower channel", as shown in the above graph. If it is a shit lobby, stomping the pubs isn't too bad now that builders get banned for leaving early.
8b) For a new titan player, they get stomped or has nothing to do for 30 minutes and ends up stalling, which ends up being boring for new players (This isn't part of the graph).
8c) For a high-skill builder focusing on having fun it's still pretty good, according to the graph, you can choose your own challenge level to make sure you're in the flow channel.
8d) For a high-skill builder focusing on winning (tryhard style):
- Collect 45g then double or triple base when you have enough wood (g2l any extra gold). (VERY BAD, BORING)
- Stall the titan, denying feed and wasting the titan's time by making the titan chase you, saving team-mates and giving back minimal feed. Then farm up a fuckload of wood and gold then base when you're 99% sure your base will hold. (my preferred playstyle, you choose your challenge level to be inside the flow channel. If you die too much then just tone down the risk level.)
- Bonus: Thing about these two playstyles is that it's complete dogshit if it's a decent titan who stomps lobbies on alts or abuses ethereal mirror to stomp 99.99% of his games (coco)
8e) For a noob builder focusing on having fun - I'll be honest, I think it's pretty shitty. You go in and you feed the titan or die and have no fun. It needs to be easier to play/learn for noobs.
-Burn
Last edited by Burn on Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ITs truly dying...
I agree with the majority of your points burn.
You seem to regard coco as a cheese strategy player with how much you refer to his mirror siege. I'll give you that it was his go-to method of sieging when playing molt against stacked lobbies but I don't think it takes away from his genius. The version he played was the version of the mid-masswall meta which was incredibly difficult to transition from the early game to the late game. No offense to your burn, I hold you in high regard of skill level but I will never forget when you wallwalked coco and he wotw'd you and shifted instantly 4 items on the ground preventing further wallwalking and killed you.
The best player in cocos era was miles below him so his self-intuitive ability to realize how to react to situations amazes me, most if not all of his ideas must have come from himself and that I can't do anything else than to appreciate his genius for the game we both love. I've said this before but in my opinion the shared tier 1 players of Island Defense of all time are Pongu, PLus., and coco.
P.S. can anyone make a guide on where to play Island Defense? bot name, peaklobby time etc. pin it to this subforum also thanks!
More on-topic I wish Dragon and Remixer scrapped Necos version and instead continued on the version Yokola tried to continue ID development on back in 2014 back when Neco handed over the reigns. Too late now I guess..
You seem to regard coco as a cheese strategy player with how much you refer to his mirror siege. I'll give you that it was his go-to method of sieging when playing molt against stacked lobbies but I don't think it takes away from his genius. The version he played was the version of the mid-masswall meta which was incredibly difficult to transition from the early game to the late game. No offense to your burn, I hold you in high regard of skill level but I will never forget when you wallwalked coco and he wotw'd you and shifted instantly 4 items on the ground preventing further wallwalking and killed you.
The best player in cocos era was miles below him so his self-intuitive ability to realize how to react to situations amazes me, most if not all of his ideas must have come from himself and that I can't do anything else than to appreciate his genius for the game we both love. I've said this before but in my opinion the shared tier 1 players of Island Defense of all time are Pongu, PLus., and coco.
P.S. can anyone make a guide on where to play Island Defense? bot name, peaklobby time etc. pin it to this subforum also thanks!
More on-topic I wish Dragon and Remixer scrapped Necos version and instead continued on the version Yokola tried to continue ID development on back in 2014 back when Neco handed over the reigns. Too late now I guess..
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Re: ITs truly dying...
I never meant to flame Coco's skill level, I agree he was a very good titan, especially considering he played on high delay. I'm sure if he had lower delay, he'd be better than Pongu/Plus/Kyleep/KenXtreme, who I regard as the all time greats when it comes to playing titan.Lynx wrote:Spoiler!
It was a flame towards balancing, and maybe even a minor flame at him being cheesy and using cheesy strats. At least he never resorted to item jumping or ankh jumping, which I reckon is the greatest cheese.
And to Neco, I do truly feel bad for you because I know you tried hard to try to improve ID 3.0.6e and 309d were truly one of the best maps out there even though veterans would say 2.8.5c was the best, I remember going back to 2.8.5c trying to inhouse with oldies and just from shield of fates having an hour cooldown per shield was enough for me to switch back to 309d. I blame mainly the balancing team that you chose. I respect you as a person since you're doing everything for free and on your own time, but just question your changelogs.
-Burn
- Ben_T
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Re: ITs truly dying...
This is quite funny. I appreciate all of the work you put into the game @Neco and whether any of it was a positive change or not, it kept the community alive by having active development, thank you for that. Many games of ID are currently being played on the latest patch and within the new Island Defense League. However, due to the recent responses, I believe the title of this thread should be renamed to something such as, "These Balance Changes Make the Game Actually Difficult" or maybe "The Circle Jerk of Coco ft. Lynx-"
Re: ITs truly dying...
You guys dont even play pubs. Nor do you join the IHs that happen on the weekends. Then you talk about ID dying. dafuq?
Good thread 10/10.
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Good thread 10/10.
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