DotA 6.85ne

[xSAINTx1]

@tufuuu

What is the difference between ne5 6 7 8 and final etc in terms of hero and item balance? You mentioned a few cheats for the final map version, but that it's only available for a few player hosts? Thanks

[aimskjs]

!support need more balance

[Edgeofchaos]

To those unfamiliar with wc3 cheating, there are "cheat packs" that you can put in maps which allow you to use commands to level up, gain gold, etc. The cheats can be activated by name or by a command. So those people he pointed out put cheats in the map and hosted it. Searching by the name is not a good way of determining whether or not it's cheated; other people may add cheats with other names/activators. The best way to determine is to look at the function main area, if local integer zzz is declared someone cheated it with JJCP. There are other cheatpacks but JJCP is most common.

If you're wondering about a specific map, me or Unitil can tell you if it's cheated. Adding such a cheatpack requires no skill, only following basic instructions so it's unsurprising it's being done on the new bnet.

Also very interesting. F-Train used to play here, as a very low skill player. I guess instead of improving, he realized he could cheat.

[Tufuuu]

I didn't change any balance since ne2 because I don't have a community anymore for discussing. The balance changes we did are pretty solid in my opinion (thanks also to Peachtree).

The later versions only contain some additional features like -drop to kick ruiners (requires -yes votes), some bugfixes and some new models.
If you don't like new models you can stick to ne2. Blizzard's new Patch 1.31 is ofc a disaster and broke a few things so I will have to wait a little, but I plan already a next version with 2 crucial bug fixes and a new command like -skin to choose a different model in the beginning of the game.

Cheers

Edit: My latest version is ne8 btw

[BeerLord]

f-train not only used to play here he used to be staff.

[Edgeofchaos]

Lmao https://www.entgaming.net/forum/viewtop ... 24&t=56300
the sacred texts!

[kunkka]

Been playing 6.85 on battlenet and I would be great if we can start hosting that map

[Edgeofchaos]

Do you have a list of changes that were made from the current ENT version to this suggested version? We can poll it then.

The biggest problem with the current dota version is the "big three" carries - slark, geomancer, spectre. Basically free win heroes unless you get severely outplayed
If they are nerfed appropriately, and nothing else is broken, then I'd be willing to try it on pub.

[Tufuuu]

For a complete list of changes by Dracol1ch you can check the changelogs here: http://d1stats.ru/history . There are too many changes to write them all down here.
I took the 6.85n map and I nerfed the most op heroes there : Invoker, Alche, Tiny, Spec, Slark and Bristle (in accordance with my old community and with the help of PeachTree).
(Invoker doesn't receive extra orbs when buying agha, alche's armor reduced + extra gold from bounty runes reduced, Tiny less str gain and starting mana, spec's dispersion reduced, Slark's ulti now sets in with a little delay, Bristle's quill spray dmg reduced)
Moreover I fixed lots of bugs:
- Shadowdemon's Agha upgrade (extra charges) didn't show up after buying Agha.
- Windrunner having perma Ulti
- Venom's Wards could one shot Undying's Tombstone
- You could gain fountain buff if you used blink dagger at certain areas
- Lycan couldn't cast wolves when Sylla was picked ... etc etc

Btw if you host this map I will start playing here from time to time since Battle.net is totally fucked up (Bara and Invoker now cause crashes).

[Edgeofchaos]

Did you fix the Linkens bug?

Also slark's ulti isn't the problem. The essence shift is :\

[Tufuuu]

Actually you can't compare 6.83d with 6.85n. Many op heroes in 6.83 like Slark, Meepo, Lc aren't that op anymore in 6.85. Ofc there is no linkens bug. And yes, Slark's essence shift is still strong but the ulti nerf helped quite a lot, it worked for our community.

[Edgeofchaos]

I read through a lot of that. Overall I think it's very cool that you fixed the bugs. That's really important, but you also did a lot more than just remove the bugs. Nearly everything is balance changed, and everyone will have different opinions on the balance. When it was Icefrog's version people were willing to accept balance changes because he was the creator of the game, but I don't think people would ever accept new people making balance changes to dota, especially without any reasoning/justification given for them. Because fact of the matter is you're not the creator and don't have any objective right to make balance changes any more than every other person who plays this game.

I don't like the dota 2 changes all migrating over here. If I wanted dota 2, I would go play it. Anyone who wants to play dota 2 has zero reason to stay on wc3. It's inferior in every way.

I doubt the community would ever accept it here, imo.

[kunkka]

Yea due to the aging of dota 1 player base, it might be challenging to get people to accept the new map. But I didn’t experience much change in overall playstyles, as in I didn’t really have to change the ways I play any heroes, if this helps

[Tufuuu]

I suggest you test the map on Bnet or in Single player mode before you judge. Dracol1ch's 6.85 map has been played by thousands of players and ppl were very happy when I added -em mode, the bugfixes + the (few) balance changes (again: after discussing with my old community Ghostplay + PeachTree). And 90+% of the games in DotA games in Bnet are hosted with the 6.85ne maps which shows that most people prefer the newer map.
But I am not here for discussing, it's up to you guys. I just wanted to feed you with some information.

Happy gaming &
Cheers

[Edgeofchaos]

BTW We don't know who PeachTree is so bringing that up doesn't mean much to me