Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby CountChocula96 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:09 am

karasu. wrote:I understand but it's all just too circumstantial for me. I mean I'm not 100% correct at MH detection, somebody with more skill would have to look into it but I just don't think I would say agreements was flaming. I mean he could stand to be a little nicer but dota has a wide array of immaturity within its community. As for agreements mhing that's a whole different story.

Agreed, these are 2 slightly separate issues.

I will be examining the replay and forwarding any info to you guys ofc. It's good to make threads like this to at least have the precedent set, so we can get this guy removed if more people are coming forward in the future with similar stories.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby uakf.b » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:23 am

I understand the rules but my concern is that Agreements was outright saying that he didn't give a **** about the MHer:

55:02 / Allied) CountChocula96: why u ban me and not mh? just wondering
(55:08 / Allied) Agreements: i can'
(55:13 / Allied) Agreements: prove maphack ingame
(55:20 / Allied) CountChocula96: so u gonna see replay dude?
(55:24 / Allied) Agreements: why
(55:30 / Allied) CountChocula96: cuz their mhing its obvious...
(55:37 / Allied) Agreements: and?= : )


So, clearly Agreements took the time to look at the replay. No, he never outright said that. And no, he didn't look at the replay just because of you. Maphackers are banned after the game is over, almost never during the game.

More concerning is that Agreements banned the maphacker apparently without posting a ban request.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby CountChocula96 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:33 am

uakf.b wrote:
I understand the rules but my concern is that Agreements was outright saying that he didn't give a **** about the MHer:

55:02 / Allied) CountChocula96: why u ban me and not mh? just wondering
(55:08 / Allied) Agreements: i can'
(55:13 / Allied) Agreements: prove maphack ingame
(55:20 / Allied) CountChocula96: so u gonna see replay dude?
(55:24 / Allied) Agreements: why
(55:30 / Allied) CountChocula96: cuz their mhing its obvious...
(55:37 / Allied) Agreements: and?= : )


So, clearly Agreements took the time to look at the replay. No, he never outright said that. And no, he didn't look at the replay just because of you. Maphackers are banned after the game is over, almost never during the game.

More concerning is that Agreements banned the maphacker apparently without posting a ban request.

It seems to me that not posting a ban request is a sign of laziness/not following proper procedure. Therefore, why assume Agreements even looked at any replay at all? Why didn't he say during the game at least once, "OK guys, don't worry, it might seem like he's hacking but I'll take a look at replay later on." My guess is that he just banned him after the game because he either felt like it, or he was worried I was going to come here like I told him.

Anyway, I was talking to the player who accused Agreements of MH via BNET. There might be a strong way to validate his claim that Agreements was hacking, at a specific point in the replay. I will update thread soon.

EDIT: Seems like clinkz was full of something. In the replay, he accidentally attacked, revealing himself, while he thought that he was actually still hidden before this "Agreements" dusted.

Anyway, I think that the fact "Agreements" can't be proved to have hacked still doesn't excuse his actions. He was flaming, abusing power by bannings, not following proper procedure, and mocking users for showing concern about a maphacker.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:07 am

We will look into this.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby iCoNNecT » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:22 am

CountChocula96 wrote:(69:19 / Allied) Agreements: Dude, shut it before i make it a week instead
(69:23 / Allied) Agreements: last chance

This is sortive abuse, threatening something an admin can't do.. His flaming isn't that even bad. I wouldn't even ban him in my opinion, if i was agreements. Maybe a !tban but not !ban. I would just warn him a couple time before a !tban. 2 Days ban are for bad flaming and this isnt even bad. Agreements language isn't tolerated for admins either. Agreements told me about the language of how a mod should be, but this is even far worser behavior. I'm looking at both side of the story and yes he can't do the mh ban in game, but agreements shouldn't act so rude to the players also. If you look at the OP side also you can see agreements talking like he has special advantage because hes an admin. Like the thing i qouted, flame bans can't be for a week, but clearly he said it. Threatening someone for a longer ban, but he already ban him for the maximum time. Agreements can ignore the hacker, but the way he handle the raging ban and his attitude is a whole different story.
I read the whole chat.
CountChocula96 wrote:61:33 / All) Agreements: 0-8 with techie
(61:34 / All) Agreements: epic
(61:35 / Allied) Samolet: gem
(61:38 / All) Agreements: ><
(61:57 / All) Agreements: Excuse (They maphack)
(62:02 / All) Agreements: MUHAHAHA
(62:08 / All) Agreements: !sd count
(62:14 / All) Agreements: 1/7 win ratio LOOL
(62:23 / All) Agreements: 29/87 feed :d
(67:07 / All) Agreements: gosh you suck bone
(67:58 / All) Agreements: Considering my stats compared to your's mr. I think everybody is a maphacker :d
(68:12 / All) CountChocula96: all i said was ur awful, nothing to do with mh
(68:18 / All) Agreements: Oh no orange killed techie
(68:20 / All) Agreements: HE MAPHACK
(69:19 / Allied) Agreements: Dude, shut it before i make it a week instead
(69:23 / Allied) Agreements: last chance
(69:28 / All) CountChocula96: what am i doing wrong?
(69:44 / Allied) Agreements: You are insulting me everytime there is something
(69:48 / All) CountChocula96: how?
(69:51 / All) CountChocula96: ur insulting me
(69:56 / Allied) Agreements: How is that
(70:03 / All) CountChocula96: i would like a ban placed on you for intimidating me with bannings
(70:11 / Allied) Agreements: Fine go do it
(70:13 / Allied) Agreements: Now shut up
(70:18 / All) CountChocula96: language
(70:20 / All) CountChocula96: reporting

Take a closer look at this ^^^^

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:45 am

This is becoming recurring.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby Kaisereo » Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:57 am

Kinda rude on how Agreements acted.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:08 am

In my eyes this is abuse. I looked deeper into this. Agreements condemns people for their behavior in-game when his behavior has been cited as being deplorable. He is what is considered the head administration position so he of all people should know the guidelines that were set by uakf.b. Not only are his manners atrocious but he also threatened to ban him for a week which is against the rules considering the maximum threshold set by our lead administrator is 2 days maximum. On top of that, chocula's behavior wasn't even bad enough to warrant a 2 day ban, at most maybe 3 hours.

I say three hours because the retaliation was somewhat severe. We also need to look at this at another angle. Agreements is not guilty of ignoring maphacking because he banned him at the end of the day but he also didn't use a request or follow protocol.

If he abuses then why does he have a red position? I mean if this isn't abuse then I must be clinically insane at this point in time.
'
What gives him the right to blatantly ignore protocol, initiate abusive threatening behavior because he wanted people to "shut up", and to flat out act this way when he condemns people for comparable behavior? If there isn't a reprimand done here then I truly don't know how I'd react.

This also isn't the first time that I've seen him act deplorable.

I have nothing against agreements personally, I hold no ill-will towards anyone because I'm not that kind of person but when I think something should be done in situations like this I stand firm by my opinion.
_______________
EDIT: I take back all of my earlier comments.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby BurritoCarcass » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:31 am

What a surprise, captain abuse has returned to the complaint section. For some reason, I think that the red admins are supposed to be held to the full extent of the rules and provide the best example, for the moderators and especially the players. In this case, @agreements now only abused his in game ban powers for minor flaming, but retaliated on a much worse level. You were condescending, rude, and down right wrong. Then you threaten him? How old are you?

Aside from that, this "admin" (notice the quotes for effect), has been the topic much power abuse lately. Mr. 1700 elo over night, huh? And now banning people with minimal warning? Did you miss the section on flame bans and how 2 DAYS is the MAXIMUM BAN ? Apparently you are above the rest of us not because you are a red moderator, but because you get away with it. Personally, if I found someone fluffing stats, your ass would of been gone immediately. Now you stoop to the level of a child and abuse the players. This I cannot tolerate.

I was considering leaving you be until now. Cyberpunk and Uakf.b both didn't find the abuse of stats fluffing to be substantial enough to remove your admin, but now you are flaming, threatening, and abusing more. I honestly don't know where you get off. However, I understand your view of not kicking the maphacker, but you not only express minimal sympathy for your team, but you also return the ignorance and childish behavior that you are receiving. You aren't a role model like an admin should be, you more or less provide the example of what not to do. Thanks your time again, buddy, I hope this is good bye for you, but then again, this will most likely be brushed off too.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:34 am

I will tell you that after looking into this I deleted all of my old comments defending agreements and I have revoked your ban. Your unban reason will have this topic for reference. When he rigged his stats, nothing was done yes burrito is 100% right.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:55 am

You threatened to remove me from staff in chat for correcting your grammar, you really want to go there? My behavior is meant to be humorous, you just take things way too seriously. I don't try to insult people. How about in stead of deflecting the blame you focus on the matter at hand, wait that's not your style I suppose. Oh well, it matters not.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby BurritoCarcass » Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:02 am

And you threatened to remove @yondaime in chat for arguing with you. I feel like you are just too big headed for a position like red moderator. Your power abuse is rampant and if anyone confronts you, you threaten them with removal, who the hell are you? You get mad at people for standing up for what they believe it and fighting for the right thing. You really make me laugh. You perceive jokes and morality as personal attacks and that reveals your insecurity. Perhaps if you obeyed the rules and didn't abuse your privileges, these complaints wouldn't be so frequent, good day to you sir, I'll let the people in higher positions decide your fate.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:04 am

You have to be joking, I wasn't even trying to insult you in chat but when you say "let's compare our behavior" I tend to bring up things like that. Cyber was there that day, I was in no way trying to insult you. If you want to post the chat log then go ahead, I have nothing to hide. I was being sarcastic, sarcastic and condescending are two very different things but like usual you tend to over-dramatize things. Yeah I got heated after the fact when you threatened to remove me from staff but I would not say by any means that my behavior prior to me getting heated was condescending in the least.

You just need to stop taking things so seriously and threatening people to please yourself.

Make sure to post the entire chat log though, not just parts that suit you.

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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby CountChocula96 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:06 am

This guy's a joke. I am a COMPLETE newcomer to your people's servers, I literally didn't even know about this site until this guy's actions forced me to look it up.

I thought it was some sort of weird ass "family run server" that permabans you for swearing when I was having agreements threatening to ban me for a week for saying the word "tard" or "penis." And then he showed 0 care about an obvious MHer running from ganks 200 miles away. He said it was "sentry wards."

Coming here and knowing the mod team ONLY from having contact with this guy, I expected this place to be a joke, but that expectation was wrong. It seems like there are actually a large number of people here who actually give a crap about the people playing on their bot.

Just my 2 cents.
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Re: Banned for "flaming" while "Agreements"ignores maphacker

Postby karasu. » Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:08 am

Agreements wrote:
karasu. wrote:You have to be joking, I wasn't even trying to insult you in chat but when you say "let's compare our behavior" I tend to bring up things like that. Cyber was there that day, I was in no way trying to insult you. If you want to post the chat log then go ahead, I have nothing to hide. I was being sarcastic, sarcastic and condescending are two very different things but like usual you tend to over-dramatize things. Yeah I got heated after the fact when you threatened to remove me from staff but I would not say by any means that my behavior prior to me getting heated was condescending in the least.

You just need to stop taking things so seriously and threatening people to please yourself.

Make sure to post the entire chat log though, not just parts that suit you.


Were you childish in any way? Where you condescending in any way? Were you above me, and did not respect me? I guess you do everything correctly, sorry Karasu. Cyber likes you, +1 for you.

I was childish after YOUR threat in terms of my anger, yes and I am not going to refute that. Me correcting your grammar was not meant to be insulting or condescending. I am a sarcastic person and if you really want to remove me from staff for that then that's your choice guy. I won't hold any bad blood over it. You just need to stop threatening people to try to get your way, I mean that is childish. You just automatically assume that it's disrespect.


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