Dota Rules changes

[EdgeOfChaos]

Actually, I only referenced your ban in 1/5 lines, and the other 4 were about your suggestion.

[NoPicnic]

Thanks for your suggestions.

So you would still ban someone for just saying, "I'm done, I jungle, and let you end" and jungling for rest game. Seems to be splitting hairs and not very concrete. What if he ends up carrying game? So jungling entire game but not carrying is ban able? This is where concrete rules come in handy.

[teller55]

The only issue, is that you can't have a "catch all" list of rules that would be able to define every single instance of game ruining. And if a list were defined, someone would do something intentionally ruining the game and state that it wasn't on the list. If we defined game ruining, that would fall through the cracks.

Also, most people know *in general* what not to do in a game to ruin it because they don't like people doing the same things to them. And if we had a 600 line list of rules of what constituted "game ruining" I guarantee you that 99.9% of users wouldn't read it. That's like expecting people to read a "Terms of Use" contract when they install software or visit websites, etc., 99.9% of people don't.

[NoPicnic]

Understandable. Do you really think the list be be long? Because I feel game ruining offenses are VERY specific. I don't the list would get above 20. Also as I said in 1st post tweaking how some rules are written to make them a little detailed.

You also need to realize even if 99.9% don't read they still need to be there. They are there for reason. You can't make them read, but they justify why you ban players. If someone says I didn't know that was a rule. Point them to rules page. It helps cover mods actions rather then looking biased or interpreting the rules by a certain individual. Which could change by whichever mod reads your ban request or appeal first.

[EdgeOfChaos]

Thanks for your suggestions.

So you would still ban someone for just saying, "I'm done, I jungle, and let you end" and jungling for rest game. Seems to be splitting hairs and not very concrete. What if he ends up carrying game? So jungling entire game but not carrying is ban able? This is where concrete rules come in handy.

If they did that and then didn't defend while the enemies raxed and ended, yes.

[NoPicnic]

I would agree. So..."farming/jungling nuetrals for entire game with no attempt to defend base or attack opposing base."

See specific is good. Detailed rules help keep people in line and also help mods when banning.

Maybe I'm completely off base but I've played dota a long time, and I don't see a list being extremely long for game ruining because they are so specific. Also many ENT rules cover most of them.

[supersexyy]

And so according to your rules: If I farm neutrals for the 98% of the game with no attempt to defend the base then it is not game ruining as its not in the rules.

Can't re-iterate enough how pointless this suggestion is.

[NoPicnic]

Actually no because he made no attempt to attack base or defend base.

Or simply remove "entire game" and go by farmubg with attempt to help attack/defend bases.

[ArOuNDThaWOrLD]

Why are we still arguing with this troll?

[NoPicnic]

Please dont use this thread to harass me. This is a suggestion forum. I made a suggestion for more detailed dota rules. please respect that. Youre setting a poor example to ENT community on mod behavior toward everyday players that might have a suggestion.

[ArOuNDThaWOrLD]

Please dont use this thread to harass me. This is a suggestion forum. I made a suggestion for more detailed dota rules. please respect that. Youre setting a poor example to ENT community on mod behavior toward everyday players that might have a suggestion.

In no way am I harassing you. Game ruining is game ruining, there's no way someone who is serious wouldn't get this the first time it was explained to him...

[NoPicnic]

I do not appreciate being called a troll. I was told by Yondy take make a suggestion because we talked about certain gane ruining situations. You don't have to be a jerk about it.

[EdgeOfChaos]

Bottom line is this: We can spell out all the ways we think of for game-ruining, but people are smart, they will find a way to troll their team that doesn't fall under our rules. Game ruining can be any action you maliciously take that intentionally makes your team lose.

That is a specific definition without giving a list of game ruining behavior.

[NoPicnic]

Game ruining can be any action you maliciously take that intentionally makes your team lose.

I like this line. That should be on rules. At least it's more detailed than what they have now.

[supersexyy]

You're arguing semantics.